Sunday, January 15, 2012

Star Wars The Old Republic is Terrible


Have you ever had all of your suspicions confirmed?

Star Wars The Old Republic has fortified all my doubts in big budget MMORPG development in a powerful and irreconcilable way. To say that it is simply a re-skinned version of World of Warcraft is somewhat insulting to Blizzard. I feel that this game has personally wounded me, and has set back the genre 15 years.

The easiest way to sort this review would be into the two categories, the "WOW-Clone" features and the "Original" features.

WOW Clone Features

UI, Control, and Feel

It becomes obvious that a large sum of money was dumped on this game by the great lengths they explored to avoid any part of the game feeling new. If you've played World of Warcraft, there is no learning curve here whatsoever in terms of game-play. Familiar isn't bad, but I didn't buy a WoW expansion...

The only real difference is that SWTOR's location integrity (characters being where they say they are) is actually far worse. This was notoriously bad in Warcraft, and the solution they employed was giving nearly everyone ranged abilities so you don't have to actually stand near your opponents. Apparently you can't throw money at bad code and make it good.

"PvP" Combat

Emphasis on the sarcastic quotation marks. SWTOR's PvP follows the post-vanilla WoW formula. PvP is mostly instanced (in extremely repetitive Warzones), and all World PvP is zerg ganking and res-killing. A few classes get decent knockbacks, and the World of Star Wars is largely cliff-centric. This is amusing for about 8 seconds.

You PvP to get PvP Gear which you use to PvP. It was obviously tacked on (like World of Warcraft), and they made no attempt to integrate it into the game on any non-shallow level.

The pacing of combat is mind-numbing. A fight with two dps-classes could last minutes, and it feels even slower than that. Because every class has either primary ranged attacks, charges, or pulls, there is no sense that you're picking your targets tactically because there are no tactics. Strategic cliffs are the only way to win, but most of the time your enemy isn't where they appear to be so you waste your knockback cooldown and shoot them to safety. Before any of you geniuses try and rationalize this, my ping is 30ms.

When your Warzone ends, you gain experience based on how your team did. Your team will always be full of the type of incompetent douche-bags that enjoy this game. Prepare for disappointment every time.

Instancing / Raiding

Anyone who believes in an open world understands why the thought of raiding makes me vomit in my own mouth. Although the instancing system appears different than World of Warcraft due to the huge number of cutscene conversations you're forced to have, it is largely the same, if not less worth-while. Having a 5 minute conversation after every pull doesn't yield experience, so if your goal is to level up, you're better off doing anything else.

There is typically an instance for every level range along the way, but they're largely disjointed and uninteresting. This, again, wouldn't matter if you weren't forced to have a time-out every 5 minutes to tell a hologram why you think they deserve to die.

Graphics and Immersion

Yes, graphics go in the "WoW Clone" section. If you've seen the game, you should understand that the approach they took was much like Blizzard's. Essentially they designed the game to age well by emphasizing style over technology. The textures appear to render in waves, gradually scaling up every time you load an area. I wouldn't consider graphics to be an incredibly important component to a game's fun-factor, but nothing breaks immersion like having a chat with a faceless low-res model whose face phases in after a few seconds of talking. Common sense people!

Character Creation and Customization

The character creation is very true to the industry standard. You pick your class and race (which have some irrelevant restrictions), and you pick what stupid plastic haircut you want to stare at for 200 hours. The only improvement is that you can make your character fat. Finally!

Unlike Warcraft where you select your race based on abilities that could benefit your character, SWTOR only has useless social emotes for the various races. This was almost insulting to my intelligence that they list the commands at all.

Republic and Empire have mirrored classes with the exception of the class story which is either a hippie love fest, or a serial killer's manifesto respectively. I'll get to this later.

Original Features

Crew and Crafting

This aspect of the game is mildly amusing until you realize what's actually happening. Your crew, for people unfamiliar with the KotOR franchise, is comprised entirely of whiny dipshits who hate when you have fun. They are somewhat customizable, and you can equip them with gear if you feel like you're not spending enough money on yourself.

You can have one follow you around (or rather, you'll be shitty if you don't), and you can assign others to run crafting errands between 3 crew skills you choose around level 10. It costs an exponentially increasing amount of money to have them run errands as you progress in skill. In essense, you're almost exclusively paying money to gain skill points, and the items you can make once you've dumped your money down the drain are seldom an improvement from the items you got with the quests that gave you the money in the first place.

I suppose they decided that players should never have money to train, so they tempt them with the laziest progression system to date. Occasionally when you're not an asshole to your crew they'll have conversations with you that yield experience, but the gifts you give them come from crew runs that you paid them to go on. I understand that the idea of buying friends might be commonplace with the trolls at EA and Bioware, but what lesson is that really teaching.

Either way, crew members in combat are basically hunter-pets from Warcraft, so that could be in the clone section as well... But hell, I'm feeling generous.

Class-Specific Story and Voice Acting

Have you ever played a MMORPG and thought, "Man! I hope they take my freedom away and force me to walk in a straight line until I've resolved the primary plot objectives!" No? Me either. Age of Conan attempted to do this, and people pointed out that it isn't very immersive that every person on earth is an escaped slave from the same ship. Having 8 different ships doesn't really diffuse the problem by a factor of 8.

MMORPGs used to have "carving out your own place in the world" as a primary requirement. What we're seeing now is the dismantling of free-will as we know it. The beauty of playing a game with other real people is that your experience can be unpredictable and spontaneous, but Bioware decided that in order for the game to fit into their traditional narrative, it had to essentially be a single-player RPG with about 20 times more grinding. Great idea, dumb!

The voice acting is laughable. If you attempt to follow the game's story, mostly everyone just turns on subtitles and skips through it as quickly as they can read. If you're a very slow reader, this game is probably fun to you, but you probably didn't make it this far into the review anyhow... moron...

The one saving grace was that the Whataburger guy actually has a voice role on Tatooine. Just like you like it.

Star Fox Minigame

Space combat is a single-player space rail-shooter that is a near-perfect emulation of classic Star Fox for SNES. I was excited to be able to play this for experience as the game itself was far too boring. Needless to say, running the same 2 level appropriate missions repeatedly killed this sentiment.

This is another 'duh' moment for this game. Why would you add more single-player aspects to a MMORPG? Did anyone really love the rail-shooting in KotOR? No, they didnt. Shame!

Dark Side / Light Side / Pointless

One of the best things about KotOR, and one of the worst things about SWTOR is the moral choice system. In Knights of the Old Republic, you chose to be good or evil, and your powers were largely dependent on your force-tendency. It was an integral part of the game, and committing genocide to make your force lightning more powerful was excellent.

In SWTOR, they go out of their way to make sure that good and evil are a purely cosmetic decision. If you're evil, you wear clown-makeup, and if you're good, you hate having fun. The only reward for consistently choosing the "threaten a child" option was social gear and glowing eyes. Why bother? Why have conversation options at all if your game is wildly unchanged by every decision you make. The entire premise of the game is bad in this respect.

A conversation at Bioware headquarters probably went something like this :
Bioware Project Lead : "We have big plans for implementing force corruption in a MMORPG format!"
EA Executive : "Good! Make sure it doesn't actually do anything! Why is your eye bleeding?"

Linear Everything!

Just in case you felt like World of Warcraft had too many similarly difficult areas, worry not! In Star Wars, you only have one path, and you must follow it because choice is bad! In this respect, they very much follow the Rift formula. Is that game dead yet?

Man, I feel a lot better...

Breakdown:

(2) Comfortably Dull
(-10) Uniquely Unoriginal
(-10) Clone City
(-10) Yes
(-10) WoW Model
(-10) No Risk
(-10,000) So Much, So Bad!

Final Score: Potato

66 comments:

  1. you compair a game that has been out for 2 months to a game that has been out allmost 10 years..grow a brain man

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  2. Compare is a second grade spelling word... How would I not compare it to the game that it copied deliberately?

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  3. WOW I think I heard the article writer IQ hit the floor..... I hope this is a joke cos no body can be this freaking stupid.....

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  4. That sounds like productive and constructive commentary. You may now return to your mom's basement.

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  5. Why would you not compare a game to the game it was obviously directly copied from?

    I think this review is FAR too lenient on a game that has duped thousands of people into buying the second world of warcraft alien/space expansion.

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  6. Try to think back to the year 1998 a game called Lineage.ohh what im i saying u wasnt born yet then..sorry man

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  7. Lineage was nothing compared to Ultima Online (1997). I'm not sure what you're getting at, but no good games have ever come out of Korea.

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  8. you just made my point..there is other games then WOW

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  9. If they hadn't spent so much money for this game, then this review might have been a little too much.

    But so much money, from such an experienced company, after so much hype and this is the result? I've played the beta, and after many reviews together with a bad experience i am glad i haven't bought the game, and to be honest i'd much rather play Kotor 1 and 2 again.

    We should give the right "message" to Bioware so at least future projects and companies don't make the same mistakes, for the sake of the MMORPG gender.

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  10. Regardless of whether WOW is or isn't the only MMORPG, Bioware made a conscious decision to copy it exactly. For the record, the only game I think is worse than SWTOR is WOW.

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  11. I hate MMO's in general.
    Yep, I said it. Wanna fight about it?

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  12. Most people hate what they think MMORPGs are. I'm waiting for someone to really take steps towards improving the genre (with originality). Sadly, the more money people throw at these abortions, the more they resemble the same old shit.

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  13. Excellent review.

    I was not a WoW player (tried it for a month but could not really get into it), but I am no MMO virgin.

    As a closed-beta tester who participated in several sessions, I knew what I was in for. However, after the thousands of posts from other testers, and weekly questioners from BioWare, and the detailed in-game feedback forums (many of which popped-up at the most obnoxious times), I was confident that the experience would be better once the game went live.

    With so many flaws and so many player complains, I figured, hey, they will fix’em. “No way that will make it to launch.” I said with the confidence of a true believer.

    Sweet Jesus was I wrong.

    I'm willing to cut the game some slack because A) it is new and B) it is BioWare, but ultimately, well, let's just say that I've switched my payment plan to monthly.

    If I were asked what TOR is by a person who’d never heard of it, I would describe the game like this:

    SWTOR is a single-player game with completely optional multiplayer aspects. It tries to strike a balance and fails hard-core. It is KOTR 3 stripped of everything that made KOTR 1 & 2 excellent. Still, if you just can't live without the sensation of a lightsaber slowly working its way up your chute inch by humming inch, buy this game. Just don't plan to stick with it more than a couple of months, unless you salivate over repetitive action. In which case, read this review a few more times. *different voice* In which case, read this review a few more times.

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  14. In the context of being a single-player game, it is, sadly, most similar to a JRPG because only a JRPG would make you grind for hours between plot shifts. I only equated it with WOW because it was very obvious that they copied virtually every aspect of the game directly from WOW. I assume it had something to do with proving viability to their corporate masters.

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  15. It almost seems you are surprised they copied WOW. Of course they copied it. Why? 10 mil. ppl plays WOW. So, if you make something similar and maybe better in some aspects you have a GOOD chance of getting that many ppl for yourself and...you make money. And this is business. It is not about making great super duper innovative game - because with budget like they had you would risk much. Instead you make something "sure" and maybe put two or three improvements in it and see the results. This is what Bioware/EA is doing. Lets wait a year and see the results, cause the game now is obviously not finished yet (missing guild bank? WTF? :-) ).

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  16. Why should I be surprised? Every major MMORPG release for the last ~10 years has been largely adapted from WoW's outline. The problem is, contrary to what you're saying, these games die off at a record pace.

    Do people still play Rift? The idea of a "WoW Killer" has been hotly debated by very stupid people who don't realize that outside of classic First Person Shooters, the gaming community can't keep playing the same shit forever. World of Warcraft has worked for people so well because it attracted novelty gamers who had nothing to measure it against, and will never play another game.

    The MMORPG genre will die if people with money keep beating the same dead horse. The Theme Park style MMORPG simply isn't sustainable, and Free to Play is completely unethical.

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  17. Well, now this is a topic open for debate... Do people want new games? Or do they want old games in a new coats? My opinion is people want both and maybe more the latter. Why I am always returning to HOMAM 3? Jagged Alliance 2, Space Empires 4? Because those were great games and I would really love to play a game very similar to those with maybe better graphics and few improvements (and there are some games like that and I enjoy them as well). So, too much new doesn't have to be always the best way. (this doesn't mean players don't want new games - they want them as well, just betting on old can be a surer way for the developer)
    Concerning WOW killers topic... Well, I played only Ultima Online, EVE, Silkroad, Age of Conan and now SWTOR. WoW I played only for a day or something to see it, so I am not really an expert on this problematic. But...maybe the reason the "WoW killers" failed was they tried to copy WoW and failed in this. Its always about details - if the game is overall great, but 50% of all epic PvP battles crash (e.g. AoC) then people will be not very pleased... In this regard SWTOR is better - far less bugs than I expected after launch (compare it to AoC after launch...). Now I am not arguing about missing content - epic instances, PvP etc. with you - in fact you have some points there and I am not pleased about it either. We'll see how fast they'll fix it. Now it seems to me they are purposely holding some additions to the game for later time (hell, how hard is to program a guild bank? - the functionality is already there). I hope EA marketing won't kill this game before it really starts. :-/

    Gho'rak

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  18. It's important to realize that a guild bank would only add to the perception that SWTOR is a WOW space-expansion. Having played Ultima Online, I assume you're aware that things didn't used to be so... imitated, but even Age of Conan ended up replacing its core mechanics with WOW substitutes. I quit AoC when they made equipment bind on equip.

    SWTOR isn't by any means a bug-free release, but we're so used to a cluster-fuck of quality control issues that we ignore things that should have been ironed out in play testing. 200 million dollars is typically enough to give certain assurances, but I'll take a buggy game with a 100 dollar budget and some original ideas over that shit any day of the week.

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  19. Awesome Review

    Too bad people will read the censored review that praise the game on the more 'professional' sites and waste their money on this garbage.

    Star Trek Online for life

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  20. The gaming press should be generally ashamed for their role in the perpetuation of shit. I feel like I went easy on this game.

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  21. Yeah, I hated the wowification of AoC as well. :-/ Nevertheless, AoC is still a bit unique for me thanks to his combat system (for melee, the casters are WoW).

    SWTOR...has also some bright sides. PvE is ok, story... This is the first MMORPG where I was really interested in the story of my main character. The side stories are well crafted as well and the voice overs really help to get into it. Makes players less bored to progress to lvl 50. If I would write a review I probably wouldn't go as far as "Star Wars The Old Republic is Terrible" but instead maybe "Star Wars The Old Republic is Average"...

    Gho'rak

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  22. MMORPGs should be a social (or in my case antisocial) experience. The fact that they dedicated so much time developing ways you wouldn't need other people is representative of their philosophy.

    It is an average RPG, but a horrible MMO

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  23. Had a bad experience with the failed patch ,server down issues and the general game play. Tied it objectivly.However I they are Epic fail and a waste of time and money.

    Starwars the old republic is the windows ME of MMO's.

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  24. They should have just made a single player KOTOR3 that could be played on console as well as PC.

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  25. I've made the argument that Bioware should have stuck to their original equation, but they've pretty consistently devolved in terms of fan-service. Dragon Age 2 was basically an abortion.

    What's more attractive than forcing your fans to buy a box (59.99) and buy 10 dollar DLC? How about buying a box (59.99) and then paying monthly fees just to keep playing a largely single-player pile of dog shit.

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  26. Dude this place is amazing. All of your previews/reviews are hilarious and sadly, completely true.

    I wish I were being sarcastic.

    Do you think Embers of Caerus will be our saving grace?

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  27. I can honestly say that that is one I haven't heard of. After Googling, I feel like I'm no better informed so I'm going to adopt the wait and see approach.

    I would say that ArcheAge (had it been developed by non-Koreans) has me slightly excited. Because it's Korean, however, i'm sure it will be grindy.

    Let's not go so far as to inflate my ego, but my main goal is to help people understand that they should be expecting as much innovation as they would from other genres.

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  28. This is the anonymous guy above...

    Dude, I agree with you. It astounds me the lack of creativity that has gone into Rift and SWTOR. The first thing that comes to mind right off the bat are talent trees. I mean, seriously, three talent trees? There was NO OTHER WAY YOU COULD DO THIS? At least with Rift you could mix and match them a bit.

    Its just too predictable. I could play SWTOR in my sleep. There is no adventure, no excitement.

    I hit lvl 50 in SWTOR, grinded out my full set of epics in a week, and then went back to Darkfall. Sigh.

    I'm excited for ArcheAge too, have you seen the kraken video? Looks great.

    Here is the website for Embers of Caerus.
    http://www.embersofcaerus.com/

    And a post by the main Dev.
    http://www.embersofcaerus.com/forum/showthread.php/40-The-Vision

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  29. If their production values are in line with their web development, I have my doubts. I'm not a big proponent of graphical perfection, but too often I see good intentions get sidelined by things that should be basic (UI, progression structure).

    Developers get these grandiose ideas about new ways to copy Ultima Online, and upon execution are completely unplayable because of ridiculous priorities. Have you seen anything on Salem?

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  30. excellent review, I subscribe every and each of your points and would add a fe of my own.

    terrible combat system
    poorly optimized engine
    riddled with critical bugs, specially in everything that involves PvP

    "Honorable" mention to the worst PvP system I've had the disgraze of playing in nearly 10 years of MMO gaming.

    If BioWare wants to save this game from burning at the stake (and maybe its already too late) they should start by firing all the Mythic developers. Those guys are failure incarnate.

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  31. The game was/is a year or more away from being ready for a release. Why do people defend them and say that it is the norm? Fuck that.

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  32. Excellent review. SWTOR is a motherfucking disaster and I would not even warrant to call it an MMO. It is a clone, and a VERY BAD CLONE that doesn't even have simple features like a fucking combat log, a workable UI, no addons, you can't even MAKE A FUCKING MACRO! Bugs, exploits, crashes, and so on. Worst of all, the core of the game is flawed with a terrible Hero engine that can't even support large numbers of players on screen which is why the whole thing is an instanced mess and why you only have 16 man raids, and only 4 person groups.

    Piece of shit game.

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  33. So what exactly do you want out of an MMO these days?

    I ask because, having played Ultima Online for years, and loving it back when I did... the idea of being put in a world and put in time to figure things out with random people in the same boat, with no aim or goal or direction or assistance, is just something I don't have time or desire for anymore. I need some kind of goal to atleast get me started. And this is a sentiment shared by many, many, MANY people.

    I just don't see how a developer can invest in creating a game like that these days and expect it to be lucrative, when the great majority of gamers need an instant hook to keep playing.

    That said, I do think SWTOR is a mediocre game, at best... and while I think WoW is a little too big for it's own sake... I have to give credit where it's due... WoW IS a very, very good MMO... it's just old now.

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  34. I agree with this review but have a few more things to add, which are all kind of out of character for me as they're rather negatively judgmental, whereas in general I am extremely overly positive and supportive.

    The fanbase is absolutely awful. Most of them appear to be in their 40s and married, either men or women. But they were losers as kids and now are losers as adults, except they don't even understand that they're still losers. Most of the time they're making up reasons why they're better than everyone else. I can't believe these types of people still exist and still play games, but now I am beginning to understand why there is a social stigma for people of these ages playing video games. Star Wars already has a lot of nerdy loser fans, but you combine that with an MMO and man, it's amazing.

    I was really looking forward to this game and then got into the closed beta. The initial interest wears off pretty quickly and I believe the EXP rates were set low in the builds I first started testing. Later builds they upped the experience gain until at least around 20 so it goes quicker. Still the story is so awful and the game is so grindy that it becomes a chore to play past around 25, and then frustrating past 37.

    Incidentally, the dumb forum biodrones for the most part can't make it past level 25. They go on and on that the exp rate is too high in this game but all the higher level planets are empty. They claim anybody that gets there "rushed" through the game and has no life. Because doing the same thing repetitively, slowly and inefficiently somehow makes you better than someone that isn't a retarded chimp. I've already hit on this before, as have you, but once you realize that these illiterate losers are who enjoy the game so much, everything kind of follows and keeps going back to that.

    During the beta they'd wipe characters every 3-4 weeks or so. At the time I was working a lot of hours and unlike the dumbasses I don't think that's something to brag about, especially if you're paying someone monthly for a game. Therefore I was having trouble finishing the stories and leveling up, as I mentioned the level gains are pretty slow. Then for a week or two they jacked up Warzone exp, so I was able to get a big chunk of my necessary experience to level up. Of course the biodrone failures complained about that, so they just got rid of most of the exp gains from PVP. Fortunately I didn't need too much more to finish the game, so I went through PVE, which is just really boring, but is considerably faster than PVP exp without the big exp buff that existed for all of 2 weeks. Since then Bioware has continued to nerf exp in PVP, including for quick games and especially for losses, removing all incentive for anyone to PVP or stay in a losing match (and now I read that people just leave WZs when they're losing, what a surprise--why would you listen to the losers on this?).

    As one of 5 people above the Level 35 planets, I noticed how awfully buggy the game was. I would try to report issues, all of us that did get that far would, but Bioware would ignore us, and if we posted on the forums the Biodrones would yell at us. I repeatedly mentioned on the forums the game needed a lot more time and was a mess. Not surprisingly that's what got released, since that was the RC after all.

    I didn't buy the game. I got Skyrim instead and have been playing that on and off. Thankfully I got in the beta so I knew the game was a mess. I know the forum denizens would claim $60 is nothing (actually it'd be around $66 with tax, then $15 a month after) but I have yet to meet someone that is well off that just throws money away. I like to give to charity, but Bioware is no charity. You can't just throw money away on scams and poor products, you really need to demand better.

    Oh and also after Skyrim came out half the beta population disappeared too. That was probably a sign.

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  35. To address the comment about what I expect in a MMORPG without just referring to other articles I've written, I would say that I don't 'expect' much. The thing I believe all ethical business should try and accomplish is either improving on something that exists, or creating an original product. SWTOR is 10 years too late to feign originality, and they were intentionally unoriginal, so that's out.

    It's way too easy in this world of managed code to create an original product, and these billion dollar companies should be held accountable.

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  36. Haha you described every Bioware game ever, there. Good read sir.

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  37. The difference is that the other Bioware games didn't make you stretch out over a MMORPG-scale grind.

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  38. You sir are a moron, sell your computer please there is nothing for you here.

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  39. He thinks he's people! Adorable...

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  40. Ok, after two months in the game with one char at lvl 50 for a month I can say that ... Star Wars The Old Republic really IS TERRIBLE. The only thing in the whole game that was really innovative and fun for me was Hutball (rugby style warzone). After two months there are still bugs - and no, you won't notice them if you play it casually, but if you play for whole weekend, if you do ops and flashpoints, a lot of PvP then you will find out there are plenty of bugs that should be really gone by now (e.g. buggy quests sharing, won warzones sometimes do not count towards your quests - even they said it was already repaired, etc).
    Only decent thing about this game are the stories of the characters, but leveling up is boring grind and if I would like to play good single player game I would go back to KOTOR anyway, cause it is better in this regard (eventhough for MMORPG SWTOR has decent storylines).
    Seriously, there is no reason to switch to this game from WoW from Rift from anything. Its the same, except here you get a lightsaber and a bunch of bugs and performance issues (we have a good engine, except it doesn't handle PvP well, but what the hell, its an MMORPG, there is no PvP there, right? ).
    I could probably go on (e.g. is EA holding some new content for next patches, or is it so hard to implement better support for guilds?), but its not worth it. If you really want to try this game, play with Jedi Knight - nice storyline, hopefully you'll finish it in one month and you will be bored enough to return to your previous MMORPG. I'll probably go back to Conan - PvP was hell more fun than here.

    Gho'rak

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  41. Yeah, I stuck it out for my love of KotOR, but there just wasn't a reason to play once I got my single-player fix. The design is inherently bad.

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  42. This game is terrible but in its defense nearly all video games are terrible. Corporate control = death of innovative, creative, actually fun stuff. EA and Lucas are massive corporations. This project was worked on by thousands of people and ultimately the failings of big organizations come through. Games designed by small teams who are just really trying to think outside of the box vs. games designed by a massive corporation are going to yield different products. I played the hell out of skyrim then played this game and then decided that 2012 is going to be a video game free year.

    This game delivers if you want WoW 2.0 set in the ancient past of the Star Wars universe. If you want that combined with the standard MMO format, no one can really say this game doesn't deliver that. I played several characters up to lvl 20-40 range on both sides and just got bored of the grind and annoyed with shortcomings of the game. That doesn't mean its the worst game ever, yet for me my love of Star Wars finally died here. As someone who has been a life long Star Wars fan (since I was a kid in the 80s ... I'm an old guy) it has been death by a thousand cuts. I very much enjoyed the KoToR stuff and very much felt this was just a cookie cutter effort. A cookie cutter of KoToR in the WoW format with some slight improvements to the format of this generation of MMOs.

    I would give the game 7s across the board not negative 10s :) Though symbolically I can't disagree with you. As far as the defense of this game ... people who love it and like to spend their lives hunched over in front of a computer screen rather than living as we were meant to ... well ... not much you can say. They are going to say "haters gonna hate" and ignore logic just as much people who completely hate all video games are going to laugh at the nerds wasting their pathetic lives (ok I'm channeling the anti-gamer people there ok ... I don't believe that I think video games have redeeming value!! Just showing the two sides to the coin). I'm somewhere in the middle. I see that video games and even MMOs are worth playing if well made. I like the concept of the MMO the large open world with lots of players in the same game. I have played MMOs extensively in the past UO, WoW, WaR ... I played WoW far, far too much. But for me no major innovations have been made in video games at all that benefit the players in the past five or so years. I don't just mean MMOs I mean shooters, I mean stand alone RPGs. I think the only innovations have been the little downloadable games, the five buck xbox/steam specials. Beyond that just like with Hollywood these days ... its all reskins and sequels with oh wow a new gun type, or oh wow ... a new crafting system. Big corporations are risk averse, they are going to go with tried and true money making ventures ... and that is what this is. It is a bankable license, a bankable format ... combined. To expect amazing innovation is unfair and silly actually. This game is what we should have expected. I spent my money, played like a fiend for about two weeks and then called it a day once that theory was proven. It isn't the worst game ever and it is far from the best game. If one wants just another licensed Star Wars ... "I'm playing this because it reminds me of something I used to love" kinda thing ... well ... erm ... have fun. For me I'd rather spend my life doing new things with people I know in reality as opposed to sitting on my already a little too large gamer ass in front of the screen for another 10,000 hours (that I wish I could get back from WoW).

    See I don't just hate this game I hate MMOs and dare I say I hate 95% of the new video game releases. Thankfully there is always the 5% ... I guess that is where the hope lives ...

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  43. I will never give any games a positive score that have already been made before. WoW's space expansion is no different. I always encourage people to support any indie project that they can get any enjoyment out of because consumers dictate the games that get made.

    If people all expected more and let EA releases fly under their monetary goals, we'll start to see more innovation.

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  44. This review pretty much sums up the assumptions I made about SWTOR when the hype was building up towards it's release. Just another theme park MMO that is simply a re-skin of the same hashed out, tired ideas.

    It's too bad that the recent attempts at sandbox MMO's have been by indie companies. Good intentions that have failed pretty miserably. Darkfall is too much of a grind. Mortal Online is just... well..... Lets just say an incomplete game that fell far short of what it could have been.

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  45. Basically in order to feel like SWTOR is a good game, you have to be willing to pay a monthly subscription for a single player RPG.

    I'm not.

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  46. Star Wars fanboy, been playing since beta. I approve this message, and while I can't bring myself to quit yet, I cannot, in good conscience, advise this game on even the most hardcore SW fan. They promise everything and deliver nothing. And why not, when failing to keep your promises doesn't have any lasting consequence? I could write exactly which promises have been broken (and have, check the forums, we're ALL pissed) but it'd be redundant.

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  47. We've all been wronged by this game.

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  48. My favorite is reading posts on other forums telling me that sandbox MMO's are are useless, because customers don't really know what they want. Somehow, this is their reasoning why having a forced linear and tracked gameplay is a good thing. Hilarious.

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  49. There is truth to that for sure. The people who can't play Sandbox style games are the same people who need to have a manager at work hovering over their shoulder all day telling them how to do their job.

    Yeah, sandboxes are a failure, which is why Maxis went out of business in the 90s...

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  50. Oh sweet jebus I love this site.

    It's like everything I've been saying the past 10 years about these fucking unoriginal corporate cut out piles of greased stool is actually agreed upon by others who realize that gaming should not suck.

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  51. The game is terrible. And they expect you to pay 15 a month to play it. They're insane. And so are the people that pay them. Just like WoW players. The game is pure, unadulterated dogshit.

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  52. Holy shit. This website is everything I've ever needed. An MMORPG website that isn't just fanboy mouthbreathers? I love MMORPGs but they have sucked dick since 2002.

    Thank you.

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  53. Going Free to Play soon. God this game is a turd.

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  54. just bought this game for 15 dollers instead of buying a new bike seat, total waste since I just found out I have to subscribe to actually play the damn game. and now I still have a rather painful bike seat ( I bike ALOT. this entire review sums up my opinion of the this game at the moment.

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  55. Your review is dead on. The fan boys should give the tit a rest and realize the garbage they're supporting. Just discovered your site today and will definitely read more.

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  56. Aren't you mad that you were subjected to such filth by a company that gives you warm fuzzies?

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  57. Strange... usually people get nostalgic about old things, but in the MMO genre it seems to be the opposite.

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  58. Best SWTOR review I ever read. Brutally honest.

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  59. can blizzard sue these guys for such blatant theft?

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  60. It's extremely hard to sue over game content as every game since pong is highly derivative.

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  61. The Old Republic just pissed me off, never mind all my prejudices against EA that are justified every time they release a game. What was terrible about this game is that for a few glorious seconds it had that Bioware storytelling spark. Being the Sith could have been genuinely interesting and fun but instead of just letting you go evil and have different ways of being evil ( That's better than a moral choice system ) they decided instead to just turn the fucking thing into a never ending game of fetch between you and the various NPCs you were forced to interact with to level up quickly.

    The Old Republic and many games like it actually managed to lower my standards that I now appreciate Hentai visual novels/dating sims because the fact is they have better storytelling and endings that make sense. No really, they actually do and I'm not making it up for satire, when I played The Old Republic it's like Mass Effect 3 where it started off okay and then they switched writers halfway through because the publishers didn't like them making continual stories for gamers to follow and enjoy.

    My only moment of peace regarding these shitty MMORPGs is they are clearly losing money because almost all the major I.P's are going F2P to try to attract people to buy their crappy in game cheats ( which is what free to play actually means ) so hopefully we'll see it all end some day.

    Someone needs to make some new good/evil type games to show the Warhammer and Star Wars I.P's that they can't rip off customers forever.

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  62. If you want to play a multi-ending RPG that doesn't suck balls play Fallout New Vegas, it's a bit dated but it's still better than this crap and doesn't force you to level up several times before you can progress through the story.

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  63. Just assume that I've already played all good games. :)

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  64. Old Republic isn't a great game at all. But fuck it, I had fun playing it.

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  65. It would have been better if it was single player and didn't have all the grindy bullshit.

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